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Thread: Workflow by using Vegas11 + Third-party plugins in large project

  1. Default Workflow by using Vegas11 + Third-party plugins in large project

    Hi,

    I am trying to begging in the right way with my Vegas11 workflow to produce a documentary around 1 hour lenght. The footage comes from 7 different interviews, each one having around 2 hours. So, joing my raw footage pieces, I have around 14 hours to deal with.

    These are the issues I need to handle to sketch the workflow. I would appreciate any comment about that. Sorry for the thread length, but I couldn't explain with less detail:

    1) The video is from camera but the audio is from ZoomH1 + lav mic. Here there is a sync issue and I have PluralEyes to deal with wonderfully.

    2) To video, I will use the plugin "Looks" (Red Giant) to deal with most of the adjustments. Some "fine tuning" will be made through "Boris RED5" (for instance, by using "clone" tool to remove undesirable elements from scene).

    3) To audio (speech from interviewees) adjustments, I will use the audio plugins (VST) Izotope Rx + Izotope Nectar.

    => The jigsaw:

    My first idea was to deal with nested projects. I mean, I would deal with issues 1, 2, 3 (above) to each interview as different .veg project and then import the 7 interviews to a main .veg project. As nested projects, I am concerning with just sync, video and audio treatment, not cut editing. All the cut editing would happening in the main project. This workflow has sounded good, because I am considering the possibility of coming back anytime to each nested project and adjust video and audio as needed, without the need of doind all the work at the begining. Actually, maybe just at the end of editing process I would make the "real fine tuning" adjustments in video look and audio aspects (in each of the nested projects, bearing in mind that the main project would be updated).

    I have begining with this workflow, but somethings aren't giving me confidence about to achieve a great result.

    a) Always I open the main project there are a considerable time to the nested projects be rendered, what delays my editing work. Besides, Vegas create huge ".sfap0" files, maybe taking unnecessary HD space.

    b) I am not confident the treatments (2 and 3) to be made in nested projects that are based on third-party plugins will be transmited to the main project with accuracy.

    c) I tested a rendering by using this workflow (but without any complex editing in main project yet). Three trials, two Vegas crashes and one finished work. I am wondering if Vegas would be more instable when dealing with nested projects.

    Any comments would be very welcomed.

    Thanks in advance,
    Cadu

  2. #2

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    In my opinion, which is not very experienced in these matters. Although I have used nested projects in the past I'm never really comfortable doing so. The way I approached the "Me & My Decks" video which was made up from footage from three different cameras ans separate audio track was to open a project and sync. up all the cameras and audio. Then I opened a new project and copy & pasted the sections into the new project. So this gave me synced up sections that I could then trim as needed. Until I had the whole piece put together. Then shut down the first unneeded project.

    Only when I was happy with the cut did I then work on the colour work to balance the cameras, which was very little work because the camera man did a great job filming.

    This approach would not be right for everybody but it's the way I like to do it. Always leave the colour work until last AND don't even think about trying to do colour work in different projects and then nest the projects. It won't be successful.

    Hope some of this helps.

  3. #3
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    Good lateral thinking Midnight. Less resource hungry and time consuming than using nests.
    cadu, I suggest you do what the man says.
    Tim

  4. #4

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    Your using an absolutely mental level of plugins and resources.

    Unless your making a hollywood master-piece, I would never dream of using that many filters and FX.

    Use the standard built in colour correct tools built into Vegas for the bulk of the grading work, your render times will double if not triple with all those third party effects.

  5. Default

    Thanks everybody for valuable comments. From the workflow to the care with intensive third-party fx usage!!!

    Just to have sure I understood, what Midnight suggests is to use a project like a trimmer. So, the desired "pieces" will be selected, copied and pasted from each interview project (source) to the main project, isn't it? I am going to follow this idea. I made some tests and it seems to work great. Many thanks indeed!

    I have a couple of related issues I would appreciate further help:

    a) Considering the creation of a plenty of regions in the source project, is there any way to copy and paste all content from the regions at once (single operation)?

    b) About audio, I am thinking on creating seven audio tracks corresponding to each of the interviewees speech. In this way, I will proceed with the treatment of an audio sample at track level (to each interviewee speech) at the project beginning . Then, I am considering that by pasting new events and draging'n dropping the audio to the correspondent tracks the adjustments will be applied automatically. Does it make sense?

    c) About video, I am a little lost. In most of the interviews I need to deal with light variation. Sometimes it begins darker and ends lighter (and vice versa. There is a short sample here=> WebShare: timelapse_ok). When I had nested projects in mind, I was not concerned about to adjust it at the beginning, since I could come back to the nested project anytime and the changes made eventually would affect the events of the main project. But with the workflow suggest by "Midnight", I will have a plenty of events along timeline that would be "hard work" to treat them individually in the main project. Treat the media would be difficult, since there are different lights along same media (track level seems to sound closer media issue). Any suggestion?

    Ps.: Camera light (or any other light to video) aren't being used. Just the natural and office light. It is because this is an academic research (not a hollywood master-piece indeed!!!) and it was decided not bother the interviewee with light along the 2 hours session. So, the idea is to solve/improve what be possible in video into the edition process.

    All the best,
    Cadu
    Last edited by cadu; 08-10-2012 at 02:50 AM.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by cadu View Post

    a) Considering the creation of a plenty of regions in the source project, is there any way to copy and paste all content from the regions at once (single operation)?

    There is a "Regions to Subclips" script, but this wouldn't help as you need to select from several pieces of media at the same time. I think you'll have to copy them to the new project as you go along. Alternatively, if you have all the bits you want marked up as regions, just delete the bits that aren't regions and sabve as your new "master" project.
    Quote Originally Posted by cadu View Post
    b) About audio, I am thinking on creating seven audio tracks corresponding to each of the interviewees speech. In this way, I will proceed with the treatment of an audio sample at track level (to each interviewee speech) at the project beginning . Then, I am considering that by pasting new events and draging'n dropping the audio to the correspondent tracks the adjustments will be applied automatically. Does it make sense?

    Yes

    Quote Originally Posted by cadu View Post
    c) About video, I am a little lost. In most of the interviews I need to deal with light variation. Sometimes it begins darker and ends lighter (and vice versa. There is a short sample here=> WebShare: timelapse_ok). When I had nested projects in mind, I was not concerned about to adjust it at the beginning, since I could come back to the nested project anytime and the changes made eventually would affect the events of the main project. But with the workflow suggest by "Midnight", I will have a plenty of events along timeline that would be "hard work" to treat them individually in the main project. Treat the media would be difficult, since there are different lights along same media (track level seems to sound closer media issue). Any suggestion?

    a) Treat the lighting issue first and render out to a new file which you will use as in your project, or,
    b) Use media FX or track FX- and use keyframes for the changes in lighting.

    Tim

  7. #7

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    Tims advice is good. Some of the changes in light is going to be difficult to overcome some it might be best to not try and deal with it, if you just get the white balance right and then use cut-aways to cleverly stitch the interview together. Leave the colour correction work until last as this will keep the playback smoother for you during the other editing stages unless you go for Tims answer of rendering out a new file to add to the project.

  8. Default

    Thanks again everybody! Based on your advices to video treatment I proceed with some tests.

    I would appreciate your comment in order to get confidence I am going in the right way:

    a) I treated the video using Vegas "color corrector". By applying it at track level it seems to be easier to deal with keyframe adjustments along timeline. By using the "color corrector" at media level, I couldn't deal as easy as through the former method (track). Is this impression shared by anyone? Or to deal either at track or media level would be the same?

    b) By copying and pasting treated video (through both methods: track or media) from source to main project doesn't maintain such treatments (they are discarded). So, here should be applied the advice of rendering the file first, isn't? Considering this "rendering" scenario, is it possible to obtain an output file that has same quality of my original footage (AVHCD, .mts, 1920x720, 59.940p)? There is a short sample of the original footage here=> WebShare: sample_mts_render

    c) Considering the light variation in my footage (here there is the same short video I posted before=> WebShare: timelapse_ok) and even other parameters I could not have noticed for inexperience , do you recommend other treatment/FX than Vegas "color corrector"?

    All the best,
    Cadu

  9. #9

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    Colour curves FX is good for contrast adjustment.

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