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Thread: Sony Vegas Movie Studio 9?

  1. #1

    Default Sony Vegas Movie Studio 9?

    Did anybody get the flier about this latest version? If so, whaddaya think? Is it worth it? The only thing I can see that's new is the Cinescore Studio plug-in which allows automatic music making to the length of the video. They also say there's an auto-setting for making and uploading YouTube vids.

    Tried it? Is it worth it? Post your experiences/thoughts here.

  2. #2
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    Seems there are 3 versions now, Movie Studio, Movie Studio Platinum and Movie Studio Platinum Pro Pack. The Pro Pack seems very good value as this is the one with not only Cinescore but also Sound Forge Studio.

    As an owner of Cinescore, I have to say I'm not the worlds biggest fan. I find it is useful for creating a wide variety (as it says on the tin) but managing where changes are made is very limited (for example, if it's in a "verse" section and you want to increase intensity this will not happen until the end of the verse - there's some musical logic to this, but music isn't generally that rigid. I do use it a lot, but find myself doing quite a bit of editing - ie chopping up the resulting sound track to achieve what I want.

    I think SmartSound is a better investment, though you'd have to but many more theme packs to get such a wide variety.

    I've not used Sound Forge (I use GoildWave for my limited audio tweaks) but the shining star in Sound Forges armoury - Sony Noise Reduction - is NOT included in the Studio version. From what I've read, Adobe Audition seems to be the sound editor of choice.

    It seems to me that Movie Studio Platinum Pro Pack is about as good an all round producy that you're going to get to take someone who's already comfortable at entry level to the next level. I suspect total noobs might be a bit overwhelmed and only use the Vegas/DVDA parts of the package at first and never get around to the other gems.
    Tim

  3. #3

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    I have Movie Studio 8 Platinum. I don't want to install version 9 because it might cause conflicts and at the worst, for sure, it'll add stuff to my already bloated Windows registry.

    All I really wanna know is if there's been any changes to the interface. One thing that really is annoying is the way it tracks paths. When you set up a new project, it creates a folder. When you go to save the project, it doesn't remember that folder, and uses the last folder you used (usually the one you rendered to). There's another problem too. The way Movie Studio interprets double mouse clicks is goofy. I make a single clck, and it's interpretted as a double click. Have these things been fixed?

    There's no mention of any interface changes in the version 9 description. It only mentions new features. I don't need those features, though the Cinescore might be useful. Such a feature exists in Pinnacle Studio and it's pretty good, but what I want are these bugs fixed!

    Does anybody have any info on the Movie Studio edition? Sony hasn't replied to an inquiry I sent them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lengo View Post
    One thing that really is annoying is the way it tracks paths. When you set up a new project, it creates a folder. When you go to save the project, it doesn't remember that folder, and uses the last folder you used (usually the one you rendered to). .........

    There's another problem too. The way Movie Studio interprets double mouse clicks is goofy. I make a single clck, and it's interpretted as a double click. Have these things been fixed?
    .........

    but what I want are these bugs fixed!
    The first is not a bug. It's certainly been there since version 6. I agree with you wholeheartedly is a PITA and would love SCS to change it, but it's by design, not a bug.
    And where do you experience the second problem - precisely? I have V8 Pro and would be interested to see if it has the same problem and whether that too is perhaps by design.
    Tim

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    What is the Cinescore properties anyway?? Is it a pre-built VSTi/DXi sound platform with the ability for free notational scoring? Or one of those Acid clones with premade loops that isn't really composing at all.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AndrewJT View Post
    Or one of those Acid clones with premade loops that isn't really composing at all.
    Love it That was very much my view of Acid etc, too, though I have to say I've softened a little having used it to "compose" for section of film (for example I built a bass line from samples of individual notes - that's composing, is it not?) And whilst throwing together loops at random to see what fits (which seems to be how they teach music at schools nowadays) some knowledge of music and composition definitely helps get things done quicker.

    Anyway to answer your question - no!

    Cinescore is even further removed from composing that Acid.

    Think of it as a collection of tunes ("themes"). You base your piece on one theme, set the length and Cinescore will create a version of the theme that long. (Are you familiar with SmartSound from SonicFire - it's like that)

    Each "theme" has a large number of variations. This is genuinely useful as it allows you to create, for example, a quiet thoughtful piece for one part of your film and an adreniline rush piece for more exciting section - but with the consistency of them both being based on the same theme.

    Within each piece you can change a variety of parameters - "Intensity", "Mood", "Tempo".

    It's a great idea which has its uses but which IMO doesn't quite work.
    The options for variations are esoteric rather than meaningful - I'm sure the reasoning behind this is logical - to prevent people making "unmusical decisions" - for example you can change the instrumental line up used in a piece by selecting line-ups 1 - 5. I'd rather be able to say I want the Upright Bass, Dobro Guitar, and Washboard.

    Another example, at 20 secs I want the music to soften to make space for a voiceover. I might want to lose the oboe melody and drums, but reducing the intensity (the option within Cinescore) might decide to drop the drums but keep the oboe.

    And perhaps the most annoying thing is that any changes you make don't take effect until the end of a section - not a bar - as section which may even be two consecutive verses - and to make matters worse, apart from a few preset song structures (which Cinescore decides upon based on the length) you have no control over the structure - so you can't decide to replace that verse section with a bridge.

    Having said all that, which appears pretty negative, I do make a lot of use of Cinescore. I tend to create the music, then edit it in Vegas (ie chop it up and stick it together again so that I can replace the second verse with a bridge, or make an intensity change mid-chorus) But it's all more work.

    SmartSound 5 looks very promising and on the face of it a better alternative.
    Tim

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by TimStannard View Post
    The first is not a bug. It's certainly been there since version 6. I agree with you wholeheartedly is a PITA and would love SCS to change it, but it's by design, not a bug.
    And where do you experience the second problem - precisely? I have V8 Pro and would be interested to see if it has the same problem and whether that too is perhaps by design.
    The second problem (mouse click is interpetted as a double click) occurs frequently. Most often it occurs when I move from one window to another, for example, when dragging from the Trimmer to the timeline or when inserting a file to the timeline from the project media panel. It also occurs randomly when trying to select multiple tracks to move as a group. This false double click creates sort of a selection tool that does absolutely nothing, and to get out of it, you click again. when you do this, you inadvertently define a new looping section. I've checked and double checked my mouse settings and it is set correctly. No other programs give me problems (most notably Photoshop 6.01 which I use very frequently, Thumbsplus 7, games, and other applications).

    I've figgered out a work around for the project path. After you define the project name, simply change the path to the directory that you save all your .vf (projects) files. That works out fairly well, but it would be easier if the software remembered 3 locations -- where your projects are, the folder where all generated media is saved, and the folder you last rendered to.

    Re: Cinescore operation. I dunno how it works, but Pinnacle Studio employs midi generation. It determines the length of your video, then auto-generates a score. You can't tell it where to put a musical bridge or a chorus. You can only define a starting and ending point. Pinnacle's variations are impressive. There are numerous styles including New Age, World, Jazz, Classical, and Rock, and each of these main genres has sub-genres. Pinnacle's implementation is quite impressive. It uses different instruments for each genre, and the range of tunes/sound is very remarkable. Compared to Cinescore samples provided online, Cinescore comes in a distant second to the way Pinnacle's music generation works. This is the one feature I hated most to give up when I switched to Sony Movie Studio 8.

    Another thing. I cannot find a setting to tell Movie Studio how much priority to use when rendering -- low, normal, or high. It seems to be stuck on high priority. Doing other things while rendering is taking place is next to impossible, though I have 3.6 GB of Ram and a single core AMD 64bit processor. Is there a setting for rendering priority? I haven't found it.

    Oh well! I'll be staying with version 8. If I make any upgrades, it will be to the pro version so that I can get more tracks available. I could use that more than 5.1 surround sound or HD support. I am not impressed with the music samples provided, and have no need for 5.1 sound or HD. I'd be more likely to upgrade if Sony made existing features work better than add new features.

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    Hi again Lengo.
    1. Thanks for posting details of your double click problems. I've not experieced that in V8 Pro at all (but I'll havce a play and see if I can recreate). Do others get that problem? Have you looked on the Sony Creative Software forum Movie Studio board? I'm wondering whether it's local to VMS or your system. (Appreciate you've checked everything and it's not happening in other apps and all that but you know how PCs are)
    2. I used Pinnacle Studio v9 before going to Vegas. The music generator was a cut down SmartSound - definately NOT midi generated. The BIG problem with midi music is it relies on you having a decent set of synths built into your sound card. So for your system it may have sounded great, but on mine it would have sounded dreadful. I don't think the version your were playing with had the same sound generator as I don't recognise any of the "titles". If you want a midi generator for simple scores, there's some abandoned microsoft thing going around (freeware now & legit) and you can also use the music generator from their photo story app.
    3. As for rendering. I don't think anyone would recommend you do anything in parallel to rendering - especially on a single core processor. 64 bit is irrelevant unless you're running a 64 bit OS. And that's irrelavent unless you're running a 64 bit app. Which no version of Vegas is (but many are waiting with baited breath)
    Tim

  9. #9

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    Re: Pinnacle's music generation. I'm not 100% sure, but I think it's midi. I've done midi sequencing and believe me, midi is very capable. With the right voices (sound samples), you can achieve anything. I'd still be sequencing, but I don't have the tools I need -- a sequencer (Cakewalk's Sonar Home Studio is good enough), a good sound card with a midi port (to connect a keyboard), and voice tables (of which there are plenty to choose from). Those cost as much as a digital camcorder, another thing I still don't have after about a year of playing with video making! grrrr!

    Will take your advice on the parallel processing during rendering. I have no choice really, so I gotta. It's working out, though. Rendering is the least of my worries. That part always works flawlessly.

    I have no idea of the differences between Studio Pro and Movie Studio. The download trial for each is the same file. Go figger!

    One thing severly lacking in Movie Studio is that the explorer will not show file thumbnails. A program called Thumbsplus gets around this. This is a great tool for anyone serious out image editing. You can learn all about it here -- Thumbnails - ThumbsPlus Version 7 It's a file/slideshow program that also allows image editing. Its' great for stills and works great alongside Photoshop. You can use this to preview images to drop into your Movie Studio project media (drag and drop). It will also show video in mpg and wmv format (and perhaps more, but I have no other formats on my Win XP rig). One thing very useful with it is that you can story board with it -- place images and video clips in a "gallery". Once you've created that gallery and set the order, you can drag and drop all the files into your Movie Studio project media window. You'll have to reorder things on the timeline, but you can use the Thumplus gallery as a reference. Is a great time saver! It's a great tool and the price is right! It's under $100 and worth every penny.

  10. #10

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    Actually with Sony Vegas 9 you can edit MPEG4 files. You can also edit MOV files like you get from your Kodak Digital Camera. The problem with Vegas 8 unless you get the Pro version you can't edit MPEG4 clips. The Sony Net Sharing Camera shoots in MPEG4 format. So you have your $90 or $130 software than cant edit files from your Sony video camera which seems odd. I have Magix software but it doesn't edit MPEG 4 either so I ended up have to getting new software. I had 4 programs in which 2 could edit MOV files from my Kodak Digital Camera. I had 4 programs in which none of the programs could edit MPEG4 Files from my Sony Net Sharing Cam.

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